January 29, 2008
TSD Ward Building
Called to order at 7:10pm by Rachel Craig, Historic Overlay Committee Chairperson

Rachel thanked all those who were in attendance and those who came to the last meeting and who have given feedback to the committee. The posters on the back wall are all the questions we had at the last meeting and the feedback for each question and any changes made. Rachel introduced the following panel participants: Nic Arning-Historic Zoning Commission; Steve Cotham-Emoriland & Fairmont and Melynda Whetsel-4th and Gill. There is a council meeting tonight and the counsel members will not be able to attend.

Jessica Rodocker - A group of people had gotten together and gathered information about materials, restoration, windows etc which were concerns from the last meeting. If anyone is interested, we have handouts about learning more specifically about siding, windows, etc. Please get with Jessica and she will try to have other workshops in the future. Jessica hopes to get feedback from our neighbors as to whom they are using for repairs and who they recommended. The committee will keep a list of recommended contractors.

Robyn McAdoo I want to take a few steps back and explain where this came from and what has happened. The South Knoxville waterfront development, which is now coming to our pillars, has many of the Island Home residents concerned about what the effect this may have on our community - "the best kept secret" in Knoxville. Although we are hidden, now that the new development is at our pillars, it makes our property very valuable to us and to a developer. There is nothing wrong with that, but we have attractive property that needs protection. Currently, someone can come in and tear down the historic houses and replace it with something that is not. I love Island Home because of its permanence and the fact that generations of families have lived in homes that have been around for 100 of years.

Robyn introduced the following panel members and asked them to make a brief statement about their experiences with the H1/NC1 process.

Melynda Whetsel is from the 4th and Gill neighborhood and is on the Historic Zoning Commission. She lives in 4th and Gill and was on the panel to see if their neighborhood wanted the H1 process. It was not easy or pretty in 4th and Gill. The neighborhood was very divided and it was ugly. She said we are all strong East Tennessean's and don't want people telling us what to do with our property. One group that felt historic properties were worth saving and that became clearer as we went through the process. In 10 to 20 years, if 4th and Gill is gone, Knoxville has lost a big piece of history. Melynda and her husband restored the house they own and will pass in on to preserve the history and sense of permanence of 4th and Gill. The process has become a true success story. IHP will construct the guidelines - no one will tell us what to do. 4th and Gill put in a statement for economic hardship to overlook some things people in the neighborhood who cannot afford things. There are no guidelines for interiors or paint colors. It is strictly architecturally based. We have now been able to create beautiful homes and our property values have gone up.

Dan Brewer, from Tazewell Pike, was unable to attend.

Steve Cotham is a member of the Historic Zoning Commission and the Manager of The East Tennessee History Center in Knoxville. As stated before, Steve lives in the Fairmont/Emoirland neighborhood which is 4 miles from downtown. The neighborhood is historic but was not quite ready for the H1. A person came in and bought 2 lots and put in 2 modular homes. The old McCampbell School was bought and a developer built 13 homes on the lot and did a huge disservice to our neighborhood. We didn't want anyone else able to come in and build something like that so we started the process for an overlay. We have very specific architectural styles and we want to respect setbacks and sidewalks where the older and younger people walk. We were not ready for the H1. People did not want the windows or roofs regulated. The NC1 has been positive. One block opted out and now wants in. They cannot get in at this time because it costs money.

Jennifer Montgomery - I am a realtor who specializes in Historic Homes and have worked with the Park Ridge community. I am interested in the H1 for them and for Island Home. So much of what I do is help people whose desire is to connect with historic houses. People are attracted to these areas because of the historic sense as well as the setbacks, porches, sidewalks and the sense of community this promotes. This is my job to sell these things. That is what people want to buy into. In Park Ridge, they are looking at about $1.00/square foot difference with the historic houses. When you drive through Park Ridge, you can "feel" where the renovation is. The high dollar per square foot is higher in the H1.

Donna Renner: I would like to introduce the following people who will serve on our panel tonight:

Nic Arning - Chairman of the Historic Zoning Commission
Rachel Craig - Chairman of the IHPNA Historic Overlay Committee
Steve Cotham- NC1
Melynda Whetsel - H1
Jessica Rodocker - Island Home Park resident and Realtor
Robyn McAdoo - Island Home Park resident and architect
Jeff Williamson - Island Home Park resident and architect
Jennifer Montgomery - Realtor
Facilitator Wilson Taylor

Mr. Taylor made the following opening statement: I am here to let you ask your questions, state your case and get your answers.

1. Be respectful
2. Be specific
3. Panel, answer specifics
4. Be concise.
5. Focus on the issues
6. Be honest
7. State your name and address before asking a question

Craig Wrisberg, 2125 Spence Place- I keep hearing the theme of protect the neighborhood and the theme beyond protection - renovation/restoration. Why do we need to do more than protect? Steve - We were not protected as evidenced by the building of the 13 houses. People were afraid of things with the H1 like the windows and siding issues but were ok with the NC1. We have had no building since the NC1. Realtors know we have it and we get to review demolition and new construction and it makes a difference. Some people have replaced windows and that has been ok. Property values do not always go up, but if you have a lot of substandard issues in your neighborhoods the overlays will help. If you don't have the guidelines for the H1 and someone has to replace something like a porch was enclosed or an addition added on it can make a difference.
Jennifer - As a realtor, an overlay encourages investment into a neighborhood and people know the houses will be protected.
Rachel - The overlays are the tools we will use to protect the neighborhood.

Sharon Shumaker, 2227 Island Home Blvd- What can protect us instead of the NC1? Are there alternatives? Does the H1 protect? Rachel - Both will protect against inappropriate development. If someone buys a property, the overlay will make it harder to build something that was not compatible. There is an Infill overlay and I talked with MPC if that was an alternative for us. The Infill Overlay and NC1 are alike in that they both regulate additions and new construction. Neither regulates changes to existing houses. Both have similar processes - NC1 through HZC and Infill through a special committee. Infill does not regulate demolition so it would give us no protection against teardowns.

Rick Bowling, 2122 Island Home Blvd - I live in a house that has been here since 1918. I am very aware that we need to protect these houses. I sat on the Zoning Appeals Board for this community for many years. You have to go before the board to get the permit to build/demolish and people can't just build whatever they want without approval. This issue (Historic Overlay) has done more to divide this neighborhood than anything we have ever had. I would like to make a motion that this committee be disbanded and this idea be stopped. Clay Smith, 2120 Island Home Blvd. seconded the motion. Comment - Only development proposals needing variances are reviewed by the Board of Zoning Appeals.

Carole Allen, IHPNA President - The neighborhood had not been notified that dissolving this committee would be discussed tonight or that a vote would be taken. I feel your pain. I hear your comments and will take away with me everything that is said tonight. I think we should take note that there was a lot of applause for Rick's motion. I will accept that motion and take it under advisement.

Charles Cummings, 2212 Island Home Blvd - I want to find out what we can protect and can stop without an H1. Melynda - We had to protect against massive rentals. We had big houses with 6 apartments. These houses sold and the owners wanted to continue. With the overlay, they can continue, but can no longer change the structure.

Lane Cooper, 2321 Island Home Blvd - I am opposed to the H1. The TN Code annotated enabled the City of Knoxville to stabilize and regulate the Historic Commission as its entity. Why is the Historic Zoning Commission needed?
Nic Arning - We have 9 historic overlays in the city. People who serve on the HZC do it as volunteers. We are an arm of the local government. We are a branch of the MPC. The MPC is pro development. It can be good or bad for your neighborhood if they approve a condo development. The city council seems pro development. We are the only commission looking out for the historic neighborhoods. We want to keep the look and feel of the neighborhoods. If you knew what Sequoyah Hills is facing - facing the developers buying up the lots and subdividing to the max. If you appeal a decision we make, it goes to the courts not to the MPC or council. You need development, but you need stability.

Danny Garland - 2144 Island Home Blvd/2161 Hillsboro Heights - I appreciate all the people who spent time on this effort. I think there is good sense on controlling what is being built. My problem is the degree of control on remodeling. I don't know if I could afford it. I don't think we moved here to be told what windows to use. Our neighborhood is that we have our own houses and some strange things that have been integrated into it. We need to keep in mind that it makes good sense to control new construction. We want to control new construction but no regulations on our existing houses. We need something to control new construction. How do I renovate my house?
Rachel - NC1 only regulates new construction and demolition. Anything that exists now is grandfathered in - nothing can be changed on what your house is now. The NC1 only kicks in if you want to tear down and/or rebuild. The H1 is for exterior changes. Steve - We tried everything to stop the 13 new houses from being built but had not recourse to stop it.

Judy Hiscock, 2209 Fisher Place - If the only reason for the overlay is to preserve then why have two overlays? I would like to see only 1 overlay for the entire neighborhood.
Rachel - We started out with only the H1, but at the last meeting we got a lot of feedback from people who live in the smaller houses that did not want the H1. They wanted some protection, but not the H1. We decided to add the NC1 for them.
Judy Hiscock - I suggest we go back to the one.

Carole Allen, 2129 Spence Place - All new development is not all bad. We will know if someone wants to try and combine two lots because they will have to post a sign that the property is under review. There is a restriction against mobile homes in our neighborhood.

Dixie Houck, 2307 Island Home Blvd- I don't know many people who have an extra lot and I have one. I am not putting a trailer on my lot.

Lane Cooper - Nic? If the H1 passes and we decide that all the colors have to be the same and if the HZC and the courts cannot take your property then can they make you conform?
Nic- NOBODY will talk about paint colors.

Bill Hiscock, 2209 Fisher Place - The information that was given out was not correct. Someone was always saying that is not what it meant. "So shall it be written, so shall it be done." The NC1 did not mention grandfathered in. I want to recommend that you double check information.
Rachel -We can do that.

Rachel Brink, Island Home Blvd - My husband and I have said we are in support of the H1. Many people now are angry at us and mad at us because we support it. I love my home and am putting time/effort/money in my home and I want to be sure that my neighbors will do the same. It's hard for us too. We don't make a lot of money. I don't want to be told what to do either, but people moving in and, because of the history and the architecture, a building could ruin the entire place.

Stephanie Welch, 2137 Hillsboro Heights- I live in the proposed NC1 and I wish we were under the H1. I understand that people don't like it. I have lived in an H1. I lived in Old North and restored a home there. The neighborhood was too late in being proactive to protect the historic architecture. People are not intentionally destroying the historic value. I was unsure of the guidelines - I didn't know about the overlay when I moved there. The H1 led to a huge amount of camaraderie. People realized we were new and were willing help us understand the history of the neighborhood and helped us with the restoration. Are there other examples of how to reassure the people that there is a reason to preserve the history?
Jessica - We will have the workshop to try and help people with the renovations. We have done the research and found that the restoration is often cheaper than replacement. There is 106% efficiency in the windows by restoring instead of replacing.
Nic - It is normal for this type of discussion. For 5 minutes/500 years it is normal to go after each other. Please speak up. Don't be afraid. There is a lot of time invested in this effort. I invite each of you to come to the HZC meeting. We meet the 3rd Thursday of the month at 8:30am in the small assembly room at the City County Building. You can come down anytime or watch it on Community TV. Watch it. See what people have to do to make changes. Drive through the neighborhoods and ask questions. We have never had anyone say they want out of it. Open your eyes. This is new to you. Find out about it.

Rick Alexander, 2224 Hillsboro Heights- I am against H1. I don't think that anyone who started this effort did not have the best interest of the neighborhood in mind. One group is for it/ one group is against it. My objection is protecting us against ourselves. I can see protecting against outside development. The NC1 if it will protect us from the outside making changes then I think we need that. I can't see a situation where the H1 needs to control esthetic.

David Miller. I am speaking for my father; Mr. Miller owns property all through the Island Home community. The United States Supreme Court has just ruled on eminent domain. Would the overlays protect against eminent domain?
We don't have the authority over that.
David- Would it give us additional protection.
The KHC gives a permit. The Knoxville City Code says if you spend $100 or more then you need a permit.
David -The law is not being enforced.

Kristine Smith, 2120 Island Home Blvd- I received the wrong communication and was told to read the website. I printed both and compared the two and found that the NC1 has more "teeth" in it and is stricter than the H1. I would encourage everyone to read both the documents and compare them. I also think the committee changed the intent of the Secretary of Interior's guidelines. I would like to know if all the committee members plan to follow the guidelines. I don't see anything about the doublewides.

Mr. Taylor - Let's just agree some of you got the wrong information. It was not intentional. Let's agree to that. You may have gotten the wrong information. Let's stipulate no trailers in the neighborhood.

Jeff Williamson, 2103 & 2134 Island Home Blvd - I have 2 houses on the boulevard and we are trying to do things to the houses. We are trying not to alter things for the individual houses.

David Keck - 2316 Island Home Blvd/2206 Maplewood - I am concerned because I had a leak on the house that was built in 1918 and when I went to try and find the wood to fix the rotten wood I had a difficult time to find the wood. My son has brick that cracked and we could not find the correct color. What would happen if I can't find the right material?
Nic - If you can't find the wood, patch it with flat pine or anything that comes close. It is not always possible to find a match for brick. You can't match brick. We know that. If you came before commission we would say good luck. Can I paint it? Brick painting is discouraged in H1.
Jeff - I have worked on many homes and it is difficult to find the same material. The intent was not to make it match, but guide you to more appropriate materials. Keep in the nature of what you have.
Melynda - I would encourage you all to come to the Historic Zoning Commission meetings. We would ask you what is your solution that best meets the guidelines. The guidelines are educational/ not authoritative. The idea is to maintain historic beautiful neighborhoods. The people on the board are there to help you.

Carole Allen - According to the guidelines, masonry not painted cannot be painted. One difference is that we don't have a run down neighborhood and are trying to build it back. We have a neighborhood this is in some amount of maintenance.
Carole:

Bob Haws, 2011 Spence Place - When you have the historic zoning they will they be on your back. Melynda you bought your house from us.

Lissa Gibbs, 2249 Hillsboro Heights - What basis is the deciding factor of the H1 or the NC1?
Rachel-The committee divided the neighborhood by districts and looked at areas that had the older houses from the teens and twenties. The NC1 are the newer houses from the 30's, 40's and 50's. The short answer is age.

Joanna Humphrey, 2248 Estelle Circle. This meeting is for information and not a vote. It is inappropriate to vote at this meeting. You said this vote was to be mailed.
Carole Allen -There are people here that are for/against it.
Mr. Taylor - Personally, I think this is not appropriate since many people who are for/against it are not here.

Daniel Jerrolds, 2120 Maplewood - I have lived here for less than 2 years. We felt lucky to have found a house here and love the neighborhood. After the first meeting, we went home and thought that we had moved in the wrong place. What would need to happen to make this not happen?
Rachel - We have been trying to get a sense of what the neighbors want. We have been trying to contact all the neighbors. We have spoken with 77 of the H1 and 76 of the NC1 of 100 which is about 77% of the neighborhood. Most of the people we have not spoken to are absentee home owners or we have left messages and have not been called back. We realize the numbers we got may not be valid. Some people were undecided or will change their mind. About 60% have been positive in both the NC1 and the H1. There are about 15-20% against both. The others are undecided or will not vote. Given these numbers, we felt people wanted us to continue.

Rick Bowling- I call for the question.

Dorcus Haws: I am tired of hearing about the trailers. Whoever called us said that he understood we would put a trailer on the river. That is not true.

Carole Allen - The motion is that this committee ceases and desists.
Barb Arnold, 2208 Hillsboro Heights - I specifically told people we would not vote tonight. I do not think you should vote.

At this point, most people stood up and started leaving, talking and gathering into groups. There was no clear vote or official end to the meeting.

The meeting ended at 9:00pm.